Made enough progress to share my story, but lots of work left to be done.

[Sickness4thickness]

I imagine that the majority of people who visit this site simply read posts without registering/sharing because they want to learn about this lifestyle and don’t feel like they have much to share. For a few years I’ve certainly been one of those people. But my wife and I have made enough progress that I feel like it’s finally worth contributing. (I already regret this user name but c’est la vie.)

I (41M) met my wife (36F) in undergrad back in our 20’s. Long before meeting her (my wife), I spent a few years dating a girl who I was deeply in love with, but who turned out to be a sociopathic narcissist. She cheated on me repeatedly, and after each episode she would manipulate me into forgiving her and getting back together, only to keep repeating the cycle. Not to be melodramatic, but it was maybe the most deeply traumatizing experience of my life. After years of this, I swore her off and cut all contact.

After breaking things off with the sociopath, I began re-learning how to have healthy relationships and dating mostly nice girls who treated me well. Confusingly, I found myself sexualizing/fetishing the thought of them cheating on me. In retrospect, I can see that I was sexualizing my trauma. In the moment, though, I was convinced that I was just degenerating into a sick weirdo, so I never dared breathe a word of it to anyone.

In the series of relationships that followed, I dated mostly good girls, but the allure of the occasional crazy chick drew me in (there’s nothing better than sex with an insane woman). Once or twice over the years I discovered that one of the crazy ones was cheating on me (I partied a lot back then, as did the girls I dated) and couldn’t understand why my anger/jealousy also came with feelings of arousal. All the while, I never dared to breathe a word about it to anyone.

When I met my wife, she and I were both finishing college (I joined the military before going to school, which is why I was older than her at the time). I drunkenly hit on this hippie Asian girl at a hip hop show at the campus bar and somehow we hit it off, despite having almost nothing in common (she grew up in an impoverished immigrant family living in a majority-black city, and I’m one of the whitest dudes you’ll ever meet who grew up in the suburbs). Fast forward ten years or so and now we’re married, white-collar professionals with a couple of kids.

From the beginning of our relationship, I tried my best to be the man I thought she wanted, rather than trying to be myself. Eventually, I realized that pretending to be the perfect husband wasn’t sustainable. So, little by little I opened up to her about almost everything going on in my head, but there was this weird sexual kink I simply couldn’t bring myself to tell her about. I was secretly languishing with these cravings for her to have sex with other dudes. I simply couldn’t fathom how I would even begin to explain that to her.

One fateful night (about two years ago), my best friend drunkenly asked me if I wanted to fuck his wife. I thought it was a trap or something so I gave an ambiguous answer and changed the subject. The next weekend he brings it up again and this time he seemed genuine so I said yes (she’s smoking hot and I’ve always fantasized about her). Now, that obviously couldn’t actually happen because I wasn’t about to cheat on my wife. But we talked about it a lot and I realized that having fantasies of sharing your wife with others isn’t as weird as I thought. The seed was planted in my brain and I started searching these forums for tips on how to open up to my wife about hotwifing.

A few days later, inspired by a tip I read on here, I showed my wife this short film called “The Girlfriend Game,” hoping to use it as a segue to start the conversation. She remarked how weird it is for the main character to enjoy seeing his girlfriend with someone else, and I confided in her that I had the same kink. She was weirded out, but she loved me enough to indulge me with hotwife fantasy talk in the bedroom. We’d watch hotwife porn and share sexy fantasies during pillow talk, but it was clearly understood that this was merely a fantasy for the bedroom and nothing would happen in reality.

A year or so goes by with nothing but pillow talk and hotwife porn. One day (about six months ago) the doctor gives me a scary diagnosis that puts life into perspective. My medical issue turned out fine and life went back to normal, but I felt like I had a new perspective on life. I thought about all of the experiences I hoped to have but might never experience. So, in light of this, I had a serious heart-to-heart with my wife about how I wanted her to explore the bounds of her comfort zone (without doing anything she didn’t feel okay with). Her response was surprisingly positive. She said she didn’t want to have sex with anyone else, but would enjoy dancing/flirting/kissing someone if the right guy came along.

The next day I took her shopping for a sexy dress with plans for her to go by herself to a local dance club that night to find someone to mess around with. And that’s when we realized how boring we’d become. We both wake up early every day because, you know, we’re gainfully employed tax paying citizens. Why do you people stay up so late?? Don’t you have jobs?? By the time the club opened she was fighting to keep her eyes open. There was no way she was going to a dance club that night.

So I went back to the drawing board. Where could she go meet and flirt with dudes without having to stay up all night?

She agreed to walk around to a few bars in our city by herself during the early evening to see if she crossed paths with anyone who appealed to her, but that didn’t work. She only saw couples on dates and groups of friends, and nobody she found attractive. We live in a very tame, family-oriented city.

She refuses to join any apps or websites. She hates the thought of browsing through pictures of people like items on a menu. She also never feels attraction to someone without feeling a “vibe” in a face-to-face social interaction.

My only idea was to take her to a swingers’ club. The club doesn’t open until 10:00 PM (why do you people do this to yourselves??), so we still had to stay up late, but at least we could go together and I could keep her motivated and be her wingman. She only agreed to go because I assured her that there would be no pressure to do anything physical, and we could just watch other people fuck if that’s all we wanted. At first, it felt like things were going well, beyond merely indulging me, my wife clearly seemed to want to find someone to flirt/make out with, but most of the other guests in the club were yuck. There was one handsome single dude there who she found attractive, but when she went up and talked to him he was drunk and off putting. What a bummer. My wife and I wound up getting naked and going back into the play area (yikes!) together. It was a pretty wild scene! There were naked people fucking all around us. I’d never imagined that’s what it would look like! It was cool, but I was so nervous there’s no way in a million years I was going to get my dick hard. I just wound up going down on my wife until she came and then we got dressed and left. It was a fun sexual adventure, but not progress toward hotwifing.

We went back to the swingers’ club again last weekend to try again and it only went marginally better. First issue was that her period came at the worst time so her vagina was “closed for business,” as she put it. Still, she could flirt and dance and make out with someone, and maybe make some new friends. We got to the club shortly after it opened at 10:00 (again, why???) and sat at a table where we could see people entering and her plan was to pounce on the first attractive dude she saw. Her dream guy never appeared, sadly. Instead, an unappealing couple introduced themselves and joined us at our table (the wife was fuckable if you had a few beers, but the husband was ugly as shit). We made polite conversation and tried our best to be friendly and charming, but it just felt awkward because it seemed like they were looking for a full swap and I wasn’t giving the other wife any flirty attention. After a bunch of drinks my wife wound up making out with the other wife, which I guess is something. We left shortly after midnight when people started moving to the play area.

So that’s where we’re at. We talk openly about my desire to see her with other dudes. She tells me about it when she crosses paths with guys she’s attracted to in her daily comings and goings. She’s willing to go to swingers clubs. But the dudes there are mostly goobers and it gets awkward because the other couples seem to want to full swap and we’re just hotwifing. She doesn’t want to go online. I’ll keep contemplating the problem and update you if I find a solution.

[venus-can99]

Welcome s4t and thanks for the post documenting your journey so far.

[trecital]

Interesting story.

While reading it, and you mentioning going to a swingers club, I thought, "Oh yesh, that sounds like a good idea".
But then your story progressed, and I could see that it was probably a bad idea.
Which is just to say that I don't think there is a clear cut way forward into this lifestyle.

But, your wife hasn't shut the idea down. She was adventurous enough to go to the swingers club, so that seems very promising for her to take things to the physical level.

Welcome to the forum, and please keep us up to date with your progress.

[Sickness4thickness]

Actually, re-reading my post I regret being so caustic about peoples’ looks. I really do try to be respectful and friendly with folks regardless of their appearance. I shouldn’t be describing people as “fuckable” or “ugly as shit.” I’m very sorry. Aside from that, I hope I was being genuine.

[leggysman]

Glad you decided to stop lurking and join us :-) Welcome.

As trecital said, it does sound very promising. She seems open to exploring this, at her own pace.

Online is certainly the most efficient way to find suitable men. Maybe her aversion would soften if you set up an profile for her, add some pics, give it a few days for guys to notice her, and then hand it over to let her have a look around? No harm done if she doesn't like it - but worth a try?

If you use a decent one like sdc.com, it's not just pics "like items on a menu" -- those are just a good way to quickly weed out the ones she's not attracted to, narrow the field to the ones she is attracted to, and then check out their profiles, start a chat, etc. Much like looking around a room, spotting attractive guys, and choosing which ones to talk to. Nearly every relationship starts with superficial attraction to someone's looks. The guys online are real, available people in your area. This is just the way people mostly do it nowadays! As with vanilla dating.

Granted it's not face to face, but she might find her interest turbocharged when potentially good matches are showing interest in her. What you're doing now seems very hit-or-miss (mostly miss), and meeting men this way doesn't begin at 10pm And apart from swinger clubs and such, this is going to be the best way to find men who don't mind dating a married woman whose husband is in-the-know, without them getting weirded out. Finding that out in the real world has got to be at least 10x more difficult.

[Sickness4thickness]

News to share. Leggysman sold me on the online profile idea, so I set myself to the task of persuading my wife to play along. I knew it was going to be difficult to bring her around to the idea so I planned my sales pitch carefully and waited for the right moment to make my move.

Last night we were walking home from having dinner. She’d had a glass of wine. We were happily chatting and laughing and I kept complimenting her on how sexy she is and how lucky I am. Sensing the opportunity I took my shot. I said I’d finally gotten enough sexy pictures of her to make an online profile, and if she was okay with it, I’d run the profile account myself with no effort required on her part. I said she could look at it, or not, whenever she felt curious. And I would never pressure her to engage with anyone or do anything. … and she shot it down immediately and when I tried to respond she said “I don’t want to talk about it anymore.” We walked the rest of the way home in awkward silence.

Once we got home and she cooled off a bit, she started explaining that she didn’t want to have a profile because she doesn’t want people she knows to see it, and is concerned about the profile becoming a slippery slope. Rather than pressure her about the profile, I responded that I’d like for us to be able to communicate about anything and everything without fear of judgment or rebuke. It’s not that she refused to have a profile, the problem is that she refused to have an open conversation about it.

Over the next few hours we spoke about how much we love each other and how we want to make sure we meet each other’s needs. I didn’t bring up the profile idea, but eventually she brought it up and asked about it. I told her about how it’s common for people to make profiles without faces shown for the sake of anonymity. I said that when we were at the swinger’s club I really enjoyed seeing everyone lusting over my sexy wife. And even if nothing else ever comes of it, the profile could be an outlet for me to see people online drilling over her. Surprisingly, she warmed up to the idea and gave me her permission to make a profile. At this point, however, I felt a bit like I’d coerced her, so I told her to think about it and let me know in the morning if she’s still okay with it.

This morning, she immediately asked me if I’d made her profile. Instead of reluctant, she seemed enthusiastic. She had curiosity in her eyes! So I think I’m going to move forward with the online profile plan.

Time to fire up photoshop to make a set of photos with her face obscured. I’m not going to post any nudes or anything, but I’ve got a bunch of pics of her in sexy dresses that highlight her beautiful body.

I’ll post again if anything noteworthy comes of this!

[sg671]

Really, appreciate your detailed description and theories about the origins of your kink. I find all that fascinating and wonder how many others on this forum could pin-point how various experiences formed their arousal templates. I had a similar experience with the cheating of a with a girlfriend who shared with me in extreme detail her experience. Same girl also shared her pre-me sexual adventures (she was more experienced that I was in my 20s). Looking back, I can pin-point those conversations as part of the "origin" of my own kink... the dark emotions (jealously, heartbreak, humiliation, shame, etc) of learning and hearing about mixed and melded and formed a hotter kind of arousal.
~~~
My 2cents on your situation, from MY experience (ONLY SPEAKING FROM MINE): there seems to be an indirect correlation between urging/pushing/asking/encouraging EFFORT and actual action that is fulfilling (the distinction here being "fulfilling").

The fulfilling connections seem to just organically occur within the context of life. Granted, intentional interesting things need to be occurring that yield opportunity: classes, travel, retreats. So maybe consider doubling-down on encouraging her to explore the life-giving pursuits that she is curious about... anything really... esp if travel is involved. That's how connections have happened in my wife's live. Zero apps / zero clubs / meet ups/forums, zero outward intention (subconscious energy of course VERY likely)....

[henkie69]

Thanks for the detailed story.

[armyguyot1]

Welcome to the forum henkie69.

[Alcepsya]

News to share. Leggysman sold me on the online profile idea, so I set myself to the task of persuading my wife to play along. I knew it was going to be difficult to bring her around to the idea so I planned my sales pitch carefully and waited for the right moment to make my move.

Last night we were walking home from having dinner. She’d had a glass of wine. We were happily chatting and laughing and I kept complimenting her on how sexy she is and how lucky I am. Sensing the opportunity I took my shot. I said I’d finally gotten enough sexy pictures of her to make an online profile, and if she was okay with it, I’d run the profile account myself with no effort required on her part. I said she could look at it, or not, whenever she felt curious. And I would never pressure her to engage with anyone or do anything. … and she shot it down immediately and when I tried to respond she said “I don’t want to talk about it anymore.” We walked the rest of the way home in awkward silence.

Once we got home and she cooled off a bit, she started explaining that she didn’t want to have a profile because she doesn’t want people she knows to see it, and is concerned about the profile becoming a slippery slope. Rather than pressure her about the profile, I responded that I’d like for us to be able to communicate about anything and everything without fear of judgment or rebuke. It’s not that she refused to have a profile, the problem is that she refused to have an open conversation about it.

Over the next few hours we spoke about how much we love each other and how we want to make sure we meet each other’s needs. I didn’t bring up the profile idea, but eventually she brought it up and asked about it. I told her about how it’s common for people to make profiles without faces shown for the sake of anonymity. I said that when we were at the swinger’s club I really enjoyed seeing everyone lusting over my sexy wife. And even if nothing else ever comes of it, the profile could be an outlet for me to see people online drilling over her. Surprisingly, she warmed up to the idea and gave me her permission to make a profile. At this point, however, I felt a bit like I’d coerced her, so I told her to think about it and let me know in the morning if she’s still okay with it.

This morning, she immediately asked me if I’d made her profile. Instead of reluctant, she seemed enthusiastic. She had curiosity in her eyes! So I think I’m going to move forward with the online profile plan.

Time to fire up photoshop to make a set of photos with her face obscured. I’m not going to post any nudes or anything, but I’ve got a bunch of pics of her in sexy dresses that highlight her beautiful body.

I’ll post again if anything noteworthy comes of this!

Thanks for the update. Best of luck assembling the profile. If you and your wife feel comfortable, you will have some thankful members here if you post some of your wife's photos to the Hotties section of OHW.

[Gearup]

great start! good luck

[Rip_isback]

Hey S4T, I hope the profile thing goes well and your wife becomes engaged with it. As you explained your situation, I was thinking that online might be a great way to get things started. Good luck and please keep us updated.

[armyguyot1]

Welcome to the forum Rip_isback..

[Sickness4thickness]

Thanks for the update. Best of luck assembling the profile. If you and your wife feel comfortable, you will have some thankful members here if you post some of your wife's photos to the Hotties section of OHW.

I’ve posted a few pics here: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=74940

Update: The online profile was a flop. I created a profile on Feeld and immediately started getting hundreds of match requests. I filtered out all the dudes she wouldn’t like and kept only the highest quality, most handsome guys’ requests pending (I didn’t match with or message anyone because that would feel like catfishing), and then offered to show my wife how popular she was. She was happy to hear about being so popular, but had no interest in seeing any of the profiles who wanted to match with her.

Honestly, I can kind of see her perspective on this. I’d never seen what online dating was like from the woman’s perspective. Holy shit it’s like getting sprayed by a firehose. I suspended the Feeld account for now. Maybe she’ll be more curious later.

In positive news, I’ve discovered a new idea to try. When we were at the swingers’ club we learned about a local house party which screens guests and invites only attractive couples. I don’t like the thought of being so shallow, but these are desperate times and I believe the historians will agree that my ends justified my means. I reached out to the host and confirmed that it’s okay if we don’t swap and just watch and play among the two of us, so I don’t think it’ll be awkward.

I think the odds of my wife crossing paths with someone she finds handsome and charming are going to be much higher with this type of event. I’ll let you guys know how it goes.

[Wantsomefunto]

S4T, great post, love your pics, hope things have progressed ok and you can give an update. Maybe have your wife read some things on here might help?

[Sickness4thickness]

Update: The house party we went to back in January was… okay. It was awkwardly crowded and I found it difficult to mingle due to the loud music. I spent a few hours trying to force some small talk with another couple, which was hard because I was also strictly limiting my alcohol intake (need to be ready to perform, after all). There was one handsome gentleman who was attending without his girlfriend (he was helping the host watch the door and check people in) who was being very kind and friendly toward us whenever our paths crossed, but we didn’t get the chance to talk very much. Around midnight, my wife and I found a couch toward the back and had sex next to another couple having sex. I wanted to stay and hang out after we finished, but my wife hates staying up late so we left. On the way out, she saw the handsome single guy, exchanged a few kind words, and told him he’s very handsome. She’s never flirty or forward with anyone, so it was exciting to see that side of her finally (and to see that she trusted that my hotwife kink was genuine enough for her to say something suggestive to another man in my presence). Sadly, I didn’t think to get his contact information until long after we’d left. I won’t make that mistake again!

Months later (last weekend), we went back to the swinger’s club but this time was much different. Crucially, I used the organization’s mini social network to arrange for a few couples to meet at a vanilla bar 90 minutes before the club opened for a pre-game. This gave us the chance to get to know some people before going into the noisy club. This made all the difference in the world! We had lots of fun that night, chatting, dancing, and getting to know people. Then, when we had sex in the play room we saw our new friends having sex all around us. My wife said she really enjoyed the experience. I saw a few guys flirting with her and one guy in particular (ugly and not her type) seemed completely smitten by her. It was really fun to watch her getting all this attention and she really seemed to enjoy it as well.

Here’s the encouraging turn: over the last few days my wife has been trying to plan our next visit to the swinger’s club. That’s crazy! Up until now, I’ve been doing 100% of the planning and it’s felt like she was going to the club to make me happy. But now she’s doing some of the planning and it seems like she really wants to go back because she enjoyed it! It really feels like the train is finally picking up speed and fun hotwife things might actually start happening!

If anything significant happens I’ll post another update.

[venus-can99]

S4T sounds like a very interesting development that your wife is planning the next visit to the club. Hope both of you get what you are seeking.

[Archie457]

I have a friend who (attractive woman) who has had success meeting men eating alone at the bar of a nice restaurant next to a nice hotel. Dudes staying at the hotel wander over to eat or grab a few drinks and approach her since she is eating alone. Very flexible meet, provides openings for conversation, and their hotel room is right next door. And no pressure because no expectation for sex, just a good opportunity. And safe if she doesn't leave with them.

[Lovefeet]

I have felt very thrilled and happy when I read all your journey. In the end I felt bad however you are in a good progress. Maybe you should left her alone to fun at outside or send her a vacation lonely. I think that she can find a man which she wants and do something to tell you after come back home.

[Bogdan]

Welcome Sickness4thickness. I think many couples (at least here in europe) go thru the club fase. Most of the times it's not a success, at least in my opinion. In our case the type of people who come there are not the most friendly people, again my opinion. And reading your posts, english is not my first language I get the feeling it is not really the vibe you are looking for or am I wrong? I'm just curious...