Her Plan to Dip Toe in Hotwife Water

[afagehi7]

Mr S is a hot hung athletic guy. He's used to women throwing pussy in his face and chasing him. The idea of chasing SW may not be registering. I'm already thinking if it's not a sure thing he might not be interested.

If fish could have a man to man it would help but I know that's not possible.

I used to be hot and played in a band. I didn't have to chase a female as they would chase me. If one played hard to get there was another ready to take her place. This is my concern and I know sw and fish both want this to happen. I don't know well enough to know the situation fully but he sounds like woman chase him.

I think fish is doing as good as can be done. I can't think of any way he could improve his game.

[TheHammer]

Mr S is a hot hung athletic guy. He's used to women throwing pussy in his face and chasing him. The idea of chasing SW may not be registering. I'm already thinking if it's not a sure thing he might not be interested.

If fish could have a man to man it would help but I know that's not possible.

I used to be hot and played in a band. I didn't have to chase a female as they would chase me. If one played hard to get there was another ready to take her place. This is my concern and I know sw and fish both want this to happen. I don't know well enough to know the situation fully but he sounds like woman chase him.

I think fish is doing as good as can be done. I can't think of any way he could improve his game.

Agree, he may have zero interest in the courtship and could just move onto the next girl throwing herself at him and get an easy lay. Also, it’s a possibility that Mr. S doesn’t know how to read women if he has never had to “chase”. SW may need to be more forward and not be so focused on the courtship part.

[slenderfish]

Hi all. Your recent notes are, in my opinion, on the mark.

SW is used to being chased. Apparently Mr. S is accustomed to not having to chase. This is the disconnect.

SW initially chose Mr. S for a reason. Mr. S initially responded quite well. These base lines are clear.

Mr. S is approaching this as he would, just ready to close a deal. SW is coming to the realization that she is new to this and her expectations may not be as realistic as she hopes. So there needs to be a compromise, a negotiation if you will.

That's what I've approached with the dialogue. She needs to let him know of a clear path, one that will motivate him. He needs to let her know that he is willing to hold back for a bit, to motivate her. They should then meet in the middle.

I also go back to my early posts about my gut feeling that SW is holding to a "three date" rule before sex. That's why I was hoping she would get two of those in, early in September. But only one was able to be accomplished due to the mismatch noted above. Second date is next week. If they can come to a full communication and agreement, then the third one will be a charm.

I suggested to SW that she at least let Mr. S sample some of the goodies in any case next week, if she can lead the conversation and night down a path for it. That'll keep him in the game for the following time, in November. Of course, I'm hoping she lets down more of her guards and just goes for it once they are able to get on the same page.

[KyGrappler80]

Love the second date, almost the best. Would love to hear play by play and outfit ideas leading up to this one.

[KyGrappler80]

It's like the second martini. It's the gatekeeper.

[samlowen]

I suggested to SW that she at least let Mr. S sample some of the goodies in any case next week, if she can lead the conversation and night down a path for it.

Mr. S will be looking for openings and it honestly shouldn't take much effort at all from SW to lead the conversation down that path. They've already made out and hints have been given. If he needs to be lead down a path at this point, he isn't the guy we think he is. I understand her three date plan but don't think it's viable after the make out. A second date without further progress might turn him off for good. If SW wants to maintain her three date plan, she should consider a hand job or blowjob for Mr. S, with apologies that this is her first time and she isn't comfortable going all the way yet. He's going to need more than a few kisses and breast grabs.

[afagehi7]

Why does she need to wait for the third date? She's looking for sex not love. Right? I'm not sure what the 3 date thing is all about?

I agree with Sam above. If she's not ready to give up the pussy a BJ would keep his interest.

[slenderfish]

I want to thank you OHW friends for your observations and comments. More on that below.

I sent her revised text #3 and she was sheepish about sending it. Said she might prefer to go into that in person. I took a bit of a pause and then told her that I believe both she and Mr. S are in this standstill, in that she wants him to pursue and he is waiting for her to make a move. I said that the only solution is clear communication and that I believe this text message is direct enough to break the impasse.

I asked her if there is continuing banter via text as would be usual in this circumstance (I already knew the answer, that she wasn't really engaging via text messages). She said he had been forthcoming with texts, but that "I've been married all these years and am out of practice." So I reiterated what I said above, and she ran off and sent the text.

She knows I'm on this board and receiving feedback. I noted to her that it seems to be a consensus, that Mr. S is acting as if he is used to having a woman show her interest and then immediately bedding her; e.g. the woman pursuing (who is DTF). Also that the proposed Text #3 will "give him a boner" as one commentor noted above. So your feedback and thinking has directly translated into positive action by SW!

Perhaps this latest text, along with my observation as to banter being expected, may fire up her desire even more. If that goes as hoped, then it will be easy to suggest to her she ready herself to offer up a bj or similar if she believes she is not going all the way.

[slenderfish]

Why does she need to wait for the third date? She's looking for sex not love. Right? I'm not sure what the 3 date thing is all about?

I agree with Sam above. If she's not ready to give up the pussy a BJ would keep his interest.

She has not fully embraced ownership and freedom of her sexuality and appears to be continuing to deal with self-slut-shaming issues. Doesn't want to "jump right into bed" until she has formed a connection.

This is changing as we speak, and has already undergone a profound morphing since about six weeks ago.

I am considering it to be "newbie" behavior.

[slenderfish]

I suggested to SW that she at least let Mr. S sample some of the goodies in any case next week, if she can lead the conversation and night down a path for it.

Mr. S will be looking for openings and it honestly shouldn't take much effort at all from SW to lead the conversation down that path. They've already made out and hints have been given. If he needs to be lead down a path at this point, he isn't the guy we think he is. I understand her three date plan but don't think it's viable after the make out. A second date without further progress might turn him off for good. If SW wants to maintain her three date plan, she should consider a hand job or blowjob for Mr. S, with apologies that this is her first time and she isn't comfortable going all the way yet. He's going to need more than a few kisses and breast grabs.

Yes, fully agree. The good news is that she has mentioned her dating past when she didn't want to fuck she would divert to bj. So this is already an established path.

[BallSpanking]

Three dates for a treasure?
Mr S will NEVER get a better deal.

[Mark K]

Giving him a bj might be a really good way for them to start off actually. Especially if she enjoys them, and is enthusiastic about it. Of course he will love it. A pressure release. They will both see things clearer afterwards breaking the sexual ice that way. Kind of like SW taking a half-step before fully committing to going to bed with him. I see it as a potential win-win.

[slenderfish]

Love the second date, almost the best. Would love to hear play by play and outfit ideas leading up to this one.

Yes, it's getting a bit closer. I made the flight and hotel reservations for this trip, when the concept came up a few weeks ago, in order to show support and more fully lock down plans for her, so they wouldn't change. She has invested in the trip now, having made restaurant reservations, car rental reservation, etc.

She also has been shopping, apparently. I saw some extra activity on credit cards and saw some deliveries to the house. She hasn't mentioned anything but I have seen some of the items she acquired and they are classy and hot. Not something one would wear to dinner with mother or sister or nieces. I'll pay closer attention as she assembles her "looks" in preparation packing suitcases, etc.

She has started to retire a bit earlier at night, to begin adapting to the time change. This is unusual for her. But an observation of mine. I have a feeling that her early time in the bedroom is to accomplish alone time under the guise of retiring earlier, but in actuality it's prime time to send text messages to Mr. S because of the two-hour time difference. Perhaps this is more of a wish than reality, but again my observation is of her pattern changing by almost exactly two hours.

It's curious to me that she has indicated some texting with Mr. S (more from him than to him) and even today I did encourage her to invest in some banter leading up to her visit, and tonight she did start talking about how she is tired and wanted to start her bedtime routine early. The curious part is that she is being coy about it with me, in that she is keeping most of this to herself but then dropping hints and details here and there after the fact. She is being true to prior form, she apparently prefers to keep secrets as an automatic process, and then remembers and communicates "just enough" a day or two later.

I'm pleased at the above, in that it does more clearly show her investing in the lead-up, and likely a concomitant increase in desire. Exactly what Dr. Slenderfish prescribed.

[afagehi7]

If he was texting to flirt and she wasn't responding he'd be scratching his head wondering what's up with this chick.

BJ route is a great backup plan. Someone asked and I will too... Does she enjoy sucking cock? Some women love it. Hopefully she's one of those types.

Perhaps there's a way to reemphasize that she's married and playing with her hub's approval which is different than a single woman jumping into bed in the first date as a slut. In my mind, it's totally different.

Hopefully she'll share some of the texting. You can help her put the right time on the messages. Perhaps take some sexy pics of her that she can send if she wants. Ya know, just have them ready in case.

Anymore pillow talk about Mr S? The last one was great. I'm assuming you are telling her how hot it would be for her to give him a BJ, cum on his cock, etc?

So sand flows through the hourglass these are the adventures of slender wife.

[XYAlpha]

SF,
I keeps appearing right in front of me when I read your updates that she is withholding a lot of "information" from you. Texts, shopping, comm with Mr.S in general, and events that take place.

IMO, this is the foundation stage for the LS under construction. You are setting up a cuck scenario where you will be left out of the activities and will only be told what she wants to tell you and when she wants to tell you.

If this is your goal, you are doing it exactly in a way to establish that. If you have in mind participating, or being given play-by-play details later, you are not moving in a way that sets that up.

Have you discussed with SW your expectations for her part and for your part of the LS yet? Have you discussed any agreements to keep her, you, and the marriage safe?

IMO, you need to have this taken care of before she becomes a HW because after, feelings can be hurt, angst and jealousy might surprise both of you, and you need to have a roadmap to recover and get back on track.

Special Ops guys always say, the absolute best plan never survives first contact!

Good agreements and understanding will help in the event things don't go quite the way the two of you expect them to!

XY

[eb4cplslooking]

I feel like this is all being overthought and overproduced. If I was in Mr. S's shoes the only thing I would think is that SW is looking for an affair. I would disregard everything being said in the texts, understanding that I'm being chased and that the ball is in my court. If Mr. S truly is the type of guy who had women just "showing up", he sees right through these texts being sent and fully understands she's looking to get laid. There's no question about that in my mind.

Totally agree with this statement. Love seeing it unfolding!

[BallSpanking]

I have to say, Slenderfish, you have handled SW's HW progress expertly, foreseeing possible speed bumps and pitfalls, and arranging alternate courses that will overcome those challenges. Also, you have a strong understanding of SW's psychology, and preferences, so you are aware of her likely reactions to certain stimuli. As I said before, this may not be a sure thing, but if Mr S plays his cards right, SW may return to you as a HW.

[slenderfish]

SF,
I keeps appearing right in front of me when I read your updates that she is withholding a lot of "information" from you. Texts, shopping, comm with Mr.S in general, and events that take place.

IMO, this is the foundation stage for the LS under construction. You are setting up a cuck scenario where you will be left out of the activities and will only be told what she wants to tell you and when she wants to tell you.

If this is your goal, you are doing it exactly in a way to establish that. If you have in mind participating, or being given play-by-play details later, you are not moving in a way that sets that up.

Have you discussed with SW your expectations for her part and for your part of the LS yet? Have you discussed any agreements to keep her, you, and the marriage safe?

IMO, you need to have this taken care of before she becomes a HW because after, feelings can be hurt, angst and jealousy might surprise both of you, and you need to have a roadmap to recover and get back on track.

Special Ops guys always say, the absolute best plan never survives first contact!

Good agreements and understanding will help in the event things don't go quite the way the two of you expect them to!

XY

Thanks for the note and reminder.

SW is a conundrum in some ways, but I believe I've figured her out, many years ago. While I'm a "yes, let's do it" person to new ideas, she is the opposite. So I have to coax her for just about everything new and uncertain. When I say coax, I mean more of presenting in a way that draws her interest.

The example that comes to mind is a timid cat or kitten in its safe place (say, under a park bench). I can always get the cat to come out, but sometimes it is a challenge to get the cat to realize it wants to come out and be handled, etc. and even when it's clear the cat wants to come out, it still is a timid cat and will jump back even with a furtive move. And all progress may be lost if the cat gets spooked and runs away even for some random reason. At least, until the next time. And so it goes.

I'm letting her desire become a driver here, rather than my desire. This approach seems to be working quite well.

She has more recently started reading about hotwifing, ethical non-monogamy, etc. and really was avoiding even this until something changed in her. So it's slow progress. But the reading has brought her to the place that she now understands to a degree the concept of a "bull" as a provider of the sex, as contrasted with a boyfriend. She also has recently asked what I expect, my needs, etc. which indicates a lot of progress.

I told her my ultimate hope and expectation (being with her and participating or observing) but acknowledged that it may be difficult to envision at this point and that it may never come to that if the progress doesn't lead there, e.g. if she decides hotwifing is not for her and walks away from it before that progress is able to occur.

She asked about video or open phone or texts, etc. and I said that all of these are desired as soon as she is comfortable but that I'm of the mindset that she first needs to get this all settled in her mind and to have a satisfying experience with another man. That her first time she should do it her way. That I would love to be involved in any way possible but will not be pushy.

So I've assisted her by preparing the icebreaking email, some initial texts, etc. to assist in getting things rolling.

I believe she is back in her head the past couple of days. Again, this is normal and expected for this kitten.

As a direct answer to your point, we have agreed that we will get deeper into it all once she has decided to move forward with Mr. S and I believe this "decision" will occur after she meets up with him next week.

Mr. S has to also learn how to play kitten with her, to some degree. That, I can only assist with to a certain point.

[slenderfish]

I have to say, Slenderfish, you have handled SW's HW progress expertly, foreseeing possible speed bumps and pitfalls, and arranging alternate courses that will overcome those challenges. Also, you have a strong understanding of SW's psychology, and preferences, so you are aware of her likely reactions to certain stimuli. As I said before, this may not be a sure thing, but if Mr S plays his cards right, SW may return to you as a HW.

Thanks, I am on all points with your summary.

[tojanman]

I’m sure when she returns, she’ll at least be an oral hotwife.

[Mark K]

Things are heating up it appears; a slow burn, which is perfect.

[slenderfish]

Things are heating up it appears; a slow burn, which is perfect.

Yes, as much as I'd like to hurry it along, I'm one to remind myself that this journey and dance is itself "a blast" as one commentator put it in a previous posting.

Pinching myself from time to time.

[Mark K]

Things are heating up it appears; a slow burn, which is perfect.

Yes, as much as I'd like to hurry it along, I'm one to remind myself that this journey and dance is itself "a blast" as one commentator put it in a previous posting.

Pinching myself from time to time.

I bet you are. And congrats to both of you in your great progress so far, as a couple.

A couple of random thoughts/questions:

- Are you and SW going to abstain from sex for a week prior to her departure? She should be in a very heightened state of arousal and horny by the time of the meetup. And you should be climbing the walls in anticipation by then. Be aware of that last lovemaking session; make it special as it just may be her last time having sex as a HW virgin. Make sure you reflect on that when you are having sex that last time.

- Is SW going to bring her own condoms (in case he flakes out in that regard)? Perhaps in two sizes (L and XL), just in case. It might be an erotic adventure for you guys to go out to the pharmacy together so you can watch her purchase the condoms for her bull. She should be the one that purchases them, right in front of you at the store register.

- Does she have time to do something special for her bull? Perhaps if she is shaved to grow out a small landing strip for him (or shave it off if she has a bush now.) She can say something like: "My hubby likes me shaved, so I wanted to grow this out special for us this weekend..." It should not be about what the bull wants/likes yet, but she should tell him she wants it to be the opposite of hubby's favorite way for her to be groomed. This could be a nice opening gesture from her, for him. I think after/if they establish a relationship, it can then be about likes/dislikes between the bull and you.

- Will they start sexting (and with pictures) prior to her trip? Maybe she brings up the above point about her special grooming "for them/him" in those texts...?

- It might be hot for her to pick out her wardrobe selections for the special occasions, then present them to you. "This is what I picked out and will be wearing for him on the first night..." If so, might we get pictures too ...

[XYAlpha]

Things are heating up it appears; a slow burn, which is perfect.

Yes, as much as I'd like to hurry it along, I'm one to remind myself that this journey and dance is itself "a blast" as one commentator put it in a previous posting.

Pinching myself from time to time.

I bet you are. And congrats to both of you in your great progress so far, as a couple.

A couple of random thoughts/questions:

- Are you and SW going to abstain from sex for a week prior to her departure? She should be in a very heightened state of arousal and horny by the time of the meetup. And you should be climbing the walls in anticipation by then. Be aware of that last lovemaking session; make it special as it just may be her last time having sex as a HW virgin. Make sure you reflect on that when you are having sex that last time.

- Is SW going to bring her own condoms (in case he flakes out in that regard)? Perhaps in two sizes (L and XL), just in case. It might be an erotic adventure for you guys to go out to the pharmacy together so you can watch her purchase the condoms for her bull. She should be the one that purchases them, right in front of you at the store register.

- Does she have time to do something special for her bull? Perhaps if she is shaved to grow out a small landing strip for him (or shave it off if she has a bush now.) She can say something like: "My hubby likes me shaved, so I wanted to grow this out special for us this weekend..." It should not be about what the bull wants/likes yet, but she should tell him she wants it to be the opposite of hubby's favorite way for her to be groomed. This could be a nice opening gesture from her, for him. I think after/if they establish a relationship, it can then be about likes/dislikes between the bull and you.

- Will they start sexting (and with pictures) prior to her trip? Maybe she brings up the above point about her special grooming "for them/him" in those texts...?

- It might be hot for her to pick out her wardrobe selections for the special occasions, then present them to you. "This is what I picked out and will be wearing for him on the first night..." If so, might we get pictures too ...

Good reminder on the condoms!
The HW should ALWAYS bring her own reputable brand condoms - in several sizes. Flavored ones also when the plan switches to a BJ.

If Mr. S is such a catch and has had so many partners, she should use a condom no matter what until he is trusted and tested!

XY

[afagehi7]

Things are heating up it appears; a slow burn, which is perfect.

Yes, as much as I'd like to hurry it along, I'm one to remind myself that this journey and dance is itself "a blast" as one commentator put it in a previous posting.

Pinching myself from time to time.

I bet you are. And congrats to both of you in your great progress so far, as a couple.

A couple of random thoughts/questions:

- Are you and SW going to abstain from sex for a week prior to her departure? She should be in a very heightened state of arousal and horny by the time of the meetup. And you should be climbing the walls in anticipation by then. Be aware of that last lovemaking session; make it special as it just may be her last time having sex as a HW virgin. Make sure you reflect on that when you are having sex that last time.

- Is SW going to bring her own condoms (in case he flakes out in that regard)? Perhaps in two sizes (L and XL), just in case. It might be an erotic adventure for you guys to go out to the pharmacy together so you can watch her purchase the condoms for her bull. She should be the one that purchases them, right in front of you at the store register.

- Does she have time to do something special for her bull? Perhaps if she is shaved to grow out a small landing strip for him (or shave it off if she has a bush now.) She can say something like: "My hubby likes me shaved, so I wanted to grow this out special for us this weekend..." It should not be about what the bull wants/likes yet, but she should tell him she wants it to be the opposite of hubby's favorite way for her to be groomed. This could be a nice opening gesture from her, for him. I think after/if they establish a relationship, it can then be about likes/dislikes between the bull and you.

- Will they start sexting (and with pictures) prior to her trip? Maybe she brings up the above point about her special grooming "for them/him" in those texts...?

- It might be hot for her to pick out her wardrobe selections for the special occasions, then present them to you. "This is what I picked out and will be wearing for him on the first night..." If so, might we get pictures too ...

Good reminder on the condoms!
The HW should ALWAYS bring her own reputable brand condoms - in several sizes. Flavored ones also when the plan switches to a BJ.

If Mr. S is such a catch and has had so many partners, she should use a condom no matter what until he is trusted and tested!

XY

1. She should shave bald or even better get a wax. That'll get his attention for sure. If a woman told me she was waxed for me it would put my ego and desire to please her through the roof.

2. XY - I don't think this guy is fucking a bunch of women. Just that in the past he's not had to chase women.

3. Condoms for BJs are weird unless you have recent dental work. Did she make guys wear a rubber for oral when she wAs single? I doubt it.

4. Taking her for the Brazilian (or just for a mani and pedi if not brazilian) and condom shopping would probably be a great thing. It'll help her realize the reality. Better it hits her now so she's not frozen when it happens.