A virtual cuckold?

[newaussiecuck]

You need to find out if she is single and available. N, that is. I’m

But baby steps for now.

I did think of asking someone from my department today who might know. He's a younger guy, also Asian and spends a bit of time hanging around down on her floor with her department and has done so since at least I started about 8 months ago. He would likely know which girls are single. He obviously hasn't been too successful himself as he's not dating any of them lol.

However, he's a bit of a loose cannon and might blab to the wrong person or who knows maybe he fancies N himself. I don't know but it's a risk if I involve someone else like him. I want to set myself apart and not be tarred with his brush. Safest option would be to quietly ask one of the girls if I bump into one alone. However that would definitely get back to N and might seem a bit childish and highschool-like.

A couple of the books I read on attraction said that in each scenario ask what's the strongest course of action and do that. Today while at the sweets table I could have followed her away from the table and further away from the door back to where she was sitting and tried to talk to her more. However it felt like that was a bit much and putting me into a pretty weak position. It might have been what she wanted (or not) but it felt like it would be a weak, desperate move to try and talk more at that time. The stronger position was the quick friendly polite casual conversation that we had and then retreat quickly. I turned and looked back and caught her eye while leaving. That will likely keep her wondering over the weekend, rather than offering up a silver platter opportunity to deliver another rejection.

In my case I think the strongest next course of action is to enter the lion's den once more and just wish her good morning or afternoon on my way in or out. Maybe ask her if she'd like to catch up over coffee / tea or some such. Coffee / tea is a lower barrier of entry than a lunch.

She would most likely know by now that I'm interested, and she'll have had some time to consider whether she'd like to get to know me more. If she knocks that back then I'd have to drop it unless/until she makes a move and shows a clear signal at a later time. I don't want any sexual harassment claims!!

If she's single and I assume and act strongly as if she's single then that confidence would pay off.

If she's not single and I act as if she is, then she'll likely let me know and there's really not much to lose from the situation.

That's just the way I'm looking at it right now, and plays more into the suggestion I was given to play the long game with her. I felt that trying to talk to her longer today would have been rushing things and come off as desperate.

NAC - Easy start to this. Wedding ring yeah or nay?

No wedding or engagement ring. I first checked couple of months back when I accidentally had lunch with her. Still the same story now, no rings.

[joel68]

Good.

[newaussiecuck]

It's Saturday and I'm getting some pretty decent frequent flyer miles from all the guilt trips!! It's probably worked today, I'm feeling a bit shit.

Started by getting up early and leaving me in bed and progressed to making a deal out of having a sore back. Then later (with sore back) she snuck outside to pull out weeds which didn't need doing right now. Came back inside and feeling guilty I asked how her back was "searing pain" was the response! If you're back's sore, rest it. Don't go out into the freezing cold and bend over pulling weeds.

I asked a Vietnamese lady this morning (who I haven't seen for a few months) if she knows L's dog but she didn't. Later this afternoon I ran into PG and had a very brief conversation just asking how each other is. I wanted to and should have asked her about L and whether she knows her, but she was there with her boyfriend and I felt a bit funny asking her in front of him. It's a different guy than who she was with last year by the way.

To be honest the guilt trips probably worked enough to make me less feeling like asking PG about L today. I think I'm also a little bit under the weather too, so just not feeling on top of my game.

Maybe next time I bump into PG I'll ask to pass on a message if she happens to know L.

Other than that, yeah feeling pretty shit.

[Long Lurker 34]

It's Saturday and I'm getting some pretty decent frequent flyer miles from all the guilt trips!! It's probably worked today, I'm feeling a bit shit.

Started by getting up early and leaving me in bed and progressed to making a deal out of having a sore back. Then later (with sore back) she snuck outside to pull out weeds which didn't need doing right now. Came back inside and feeling guilty I asked how her back was "searing pain" was the response! If you're back's sore, rest it. Don't go out into the freezing cold and bend over pulling weeds.

I asked a Vietnamese lady this morning (who I haven't seen for a few months) if she knows L's dog but she didn't. Later this afternoon I ran into PG and had a very brief conversation just asking how each other is. I wanted to and should have asked her about L and whether she knows her, but she was there with her boyfriend and I felt a bit funny asking her in front of him. It's a different guy than who she was with last year by the way.

To be honest the guilt trips probably worked enough to make me less feeling like asking PG about L today. I think I'm also a little bit under the weather too, so just not feeling on top of my game.

Maybe next time I bump into PG I'll ask to pass on a message if she happens to know L.

Other than that, yeah feeling pretty shit.

NAC - Feeling like crap, hit the gym, especially cardio. I frequently found getting the blood moving really helped alleviate those sort of feelings.
Who, in their right mind goes and pulls weeds in the winter?
Sore back?! Unless there is some sort of skeletal issue it's likely soft tissue. So what she needs is a combination of stretching with heat and cold applied. Maybe a visit to a chiropractor too. There again getting up off her butt and get moving may be part of it.
Remember to breathe.

[newaussiecuck]

It's Saturday and I'm getting some pretty decent frequent flyer miles from all the guilt trips!! It's probably worked today, I'm feeling a bit shit.

Started by getting up early and leaving me in bed and progressed to making a deal out of having a sore back. Then later (with sore back) she snuck outside to pull out weeds which didn't need doing right now. Came back inside and feeling guilty I asked how her back was "searing pain" was the response! If you're back's sore, rest it. Don't go out into the freezing cold and bend over pulling weeds.

I asked a Vietnamese lady this morning (who I haven't seen for a few months) if she knows L's dog but she didn't. Later this afternoon I ran into PG and had a very brief conversation just asking how each other is. I wanted to and should have asked her about L and whether she knows her, but she was there with her boyfriend and I felt a bit funny asking her in front of him. It's a different guy than who she was with last year by the way.

To be honest the guilt trips probably worked enough to make me less feeling like asking PG about L today. I think I'm also a little bit under the weather too, so just not feeling on top of my game.

Maybe next time I bump into PG I'll ask to pass on a message if she happens to know L.

Other than that, yeah feeling pretty shit.

NAC - Feeling like crap, hit the gym, especially cardio. I frequently found getting the blood moving really helped alleviate those sort of feelings.
Who, in their right mind goes and pulls weeds in the winter?
Sore back?! Unless there is some sort of skeletal issue it's likely soft tissue. So what she needs is a combination of stretching with heat and cold applied. Maybe a visit to a chiropractor too. There again getting up off her butt and get moving may be part of it.
Remember to breathe.

"Who, in their right mind" - Yes nobody in their right mind would go out in the cold with a sore back and pull out weeds. However in her case she got a 3 for 1 tripple whammy payback from her efforts:

1. She gets to make me feel guilty as it would generally have been considered my job. So she had to go and do my job for me since I hadn't done it. Get it? I walk past that area daily and it was completely fine. Needed doing in maybe another month or two. Extra guilt because she had a sore back at the time!

2. She gets to have a pity party. Now she's got a really sore back and gets to feel pity for having such a sore back. Get it??

3. She's planted the seed in my head that I need to be proactively picking up jobs around the house that need to be done BEFORE she can get to them. If she gets to them first then I'll again feel that God-aweful guilt trip again. It could be any job and come at any time. Anything I've missed or overlooked is fair game from now and into the future. I can't overstate how brilliantly sinister this move is!! I only just now caught onto it when I came back to edit the post, the 1st two points were easy, this 3rd point escaped me and I only just caught on. I would have felt myself busily doing extra jobs around the house with no conscious thought as to why. It's about cutting short my time at the park to do these extra jobs at home.

Guilt trips and pity are two powerful tools narcissists use. I'd say they're very effective.

Today, and yesterday, she's really pulled away from me and rebuffed me a couple of times when I've tried to show some affection and support.

Cold shoulder and making feel like relationship is ending are 2 more powerful tools narcissists use.

I'm up against very powerful and experienced psychological warfare here. Did I mention one of the books I read used that phrase, psychological warfare?

It's very effective, I just caught myself feeling like completely caving in.

Edit: Thinking about it calm the next day I can admire how brilliant that move of pulling the weeds was. I just added point 3, it was a triple whammy.

[newaussiecuck]

I did a good workout and feeling maybe a little better. I think catching that 3rd element of her guilt trip made me feel a lot better. It made me realise how many times that's happened over the course of our relationship. It was pretty often. It also ties into all the work and those projects she had me do last year.

Something else happened tonight that's raised some more yellow flags. This afternoon she asked what I wanted for dinner. I resolved to make a firm decision so told her I'll buy some steaks. I was planning to cook them myself but she jumped in and cooked them.

Unfortunately the oil splattered onto her hand and a spec on her face (tiny dot). Well I heard a lot about how sore it is. I think maybe she resented what I chose for dinner and her "having" to cook it. She didn't verbalise it, but I sensed a bit of attitude and maybe small guilt trip.

I say yellow flags as it's yet another "injury" which gains sympathy and pity, and I'm concerned it could be the beginning of a pattern. First it was the bruised finger when my brother visited. Yesterday it was the sore back. Today it's a slightly burned hand, which she made a big deal of saying "it's going to blister" I don't think it will, it's very minor.

Still no L, I'm kicking myself for not asking PG about her yesterday. Maybe next time. At the park N2 was there again. My football team played today and she made mention of it, saying she watched the last quarter of the match (she doesn't follow my team, she follows a different team). It felt a bit like she's made an effort to watch at least some of my team's games and brings it up with me. Interesting.

N will be the focus this week though. If the weather is half decent I might invite her to go for a walk with me after we've eaten our lunches separately. Or invite her for cup of tea / coffee if she's not up for that. The walk could be good though:

1. She did go for a 2 hour one with her sister the other week.
2. Nobody has to buy anything or feel obligated about anything.
3. It's outside of the office and away from prying eyes and ears.

[whosbeensleeping]

Sounds like you're feeling better after your workout. Let's hope your efforts to connect are fruitful.

[joel68]

Yeah. Good luck with N.

[Domingo-ITA]

What if N and/or L and/or N2 come out and tell you they are willing to explore the possibility of a relation with you?
I mean, they probably would expect you are free. Would you consider divorcing?

And: what if neither N nor L nor N2 come out available to you? Would you still consider divorcing? Or will you wait when you meet another woman?

You are probably reading too much in those girls’ words or behaviour, still not addressing the main issue - your wife and your marriage. Maybe it’s a cultural difference, as we in Italy usually make sure what do we want - both women and men. I am aware in other countries people go slower, so I could be wrong.
However, things seem a bit confusing to me. Sometimes you think your marriage can be good, sometimes you seem to lose hope, sometimes you act as very far from your wife, sometimes you cuddle her. This may prove to be confusing for her, even though she seems very in control of the relationship.

[newaussiecuck]

Sounds like you're feeling better after your workout. Let's hope your efforts to connect are fruitful.

Thank you, yes I did feel a little better.

Update coming.

[newaussiecuck]

Yeah. Good luck with N.

Thanks for the support Joel!!

[newaussiecuck]

What if N and/or L and/or N2 come out and tell you they are willing to explore the possibility of a relation with you?
I mean, they probably would expect you are free. Would you consider divorcing?

And: what if neither N nor L nor N2 come out available to you? Would you still consider divorcing? Or will you wait when you meet another woman?

You are probably reading too much in those girls’ words or behaviour, still not addressing the main issue - your wife and your marriage. Maybe it’s a cultural difference, as we in Italy usually make sure what do we want - both women and men. I am aware in other countries people go slower, so I could be wrong.
However, things seem a bit confusing to me. Sometimes you think your marriage can be good, sometimes you seem to lose hope, sometimes you act as very far from your wife, sometimes you cuddle her. This may prove to be confusing for her, even though she seems very in control of the relationship.

Thanks for your input and excellent questions! They have made me really stop and think as I should know the answers to all of them. In reality though it's not so easy. What I want and what I can have seem to be two different things, at least to me right now. What I want is to have a happy healthy relationship with my wife. We've had a good number of years together and I always considered her my best friend. We shared everything together, and even now we share a lot of similar beliefs etc.

However, over the last 3 years at her own choosing she completely abandoned me and choose to spend her life with someone else online. All the things we normally did together stopped, and she shared all her thoughts and feelings with someone else other than me.

At the same time she missed MAJOR one time events in my life, the death of my father being a key one. It's very hard to get past this. However, even after all that I'm STILL here and trying hard to get past it. Each time I think we've turned a corner another episode or manipulation tactic grabs me by surprise and spoils things. It really does suck, and such a shame.

After she finished her online relationship she seems a completely different person, like I don't feel I even know her anymore. Still I see glimpses of how she used to be, which gives some hope. Whether it's false hope remains to be seen.

I've resolved to learn as much as I can and grow stronger and I continue to pray and meditate and hopefully my path forwards will become more clear. The book I just finished titled "The First Will Be Last: A Biblical Perspective On Narcissism" has been quite interesting and intriguing and yes quite helpful to me.

I've also learned to protect myself a lot better while I seek to find the right path forwards. I'm not taking anything for granted though and keeping my guard up.

[newaussiecuck]

Now for the update.

Today was a work from office day. I started a little earlier and walked past N's area and it was a ghost town. I wasn't expecting her in today and wouldn't see her until Wednesday.

Mid afternoon I went for a walk outside and decided to pass by her area on my way back. Note there's 2 ways I can get to my work area. The quick back way or main longer way through the office and past N's work area. So I chose that way and it was still a ghost town but N and her boss were sitting there facing away from me. I continued on and they didn't see me.

10 minutes later I was back down approaching N as she sat alone at her desk (boss was away even now). She had headphones on so I had to interrupt whatever she was listening to in order to get her attention.

It was a fairly short conversation, and it didn’t feel like she was much wanting me to be there to be honest. Briefly asked how each other's weekend was but it felt pretty awkward and then she even said "I've got a lot of work to do" and I said "Of course no worries I'll leave you to it".

I had been praying a lot to become more clear on my path forwards, and I guess I now have my answer. Both L and N seem to be out of the picture now.

[Long Lurker 34]

What if N and/or L and/or N2 come out and tell you they are willing to explore the possibility of a relation with you?
I mean, they probably would expect you are free. Would you consider divorcing?

And: what if neither N nor L nor N2 come out available to you? Would you still consider divorcing? Or will you wait when you meet another woman?

You are probably reading too much in those girls’ words or behaviour, still not addressing the main issue - your wife and your marriage. Maybe it’s a cultural difference, as we in Italy usually make sure what do we want - both women and men. I am aware in other countries people go slower, so I could be wrong.
However, things seem a bit confusing to me. Sometimes you think your marriage can be good, sometimes you seem to lose hope, sometimes you act as very far from your wife, sometimes you cuddle her. This may prove to be confusing for her, even though she seems very in control of the relationship.

Thanks for your input and excellent questions! They have made me really stop and think as I should know the answers to all of them. In reality though it's not so easy. What I want and what I can have seem to be two different things, at least to me right now. What I want is to have a happy healthy relationship with my wife. We've had a good number of years together and I always considered her my best friend. We shared everything together, and even now we share a lot of similar beliefs etc.

However, over the last 3 years at her own choosing she completely abandoned me and choose to spend her life with someone else online. All the things we normally did together stopped, and she shared all her thoughts and feelings with someone else other than me.

At the same time she missed MAJOR one time events in my life, the death of my father being a key one. It's very hard to get past this. However, even after all that I'm STILL here and trying hard to get past it. Each time I think we've turned a corner another episode or manipulation tactic grabs me by surprise and spoils things. It really does suck, and such a shame.

After she finished her online relationship she seems a completely different person, like I don't feel I even know her anymore. Still I see glimpses of how she used to be, which gives some hope. Whether it's false hope remains to be seen.

I've resolved to learn as much as I can and grow stronger and I continue to pray and meditate and hopefully my path forwards will become more clear. The book I just finished titled "The First Will Be Last: A Biblical Perspective On Narcissism" has been quite interesting and intriguing and yes quite helpful to me.

I've also learned to protect myself a lot better while I seek to find the right path forwards. I'm not taking anything for granted though and keeping my guard up.

NAC - Seeing how much that online situation affected her it's certainly not beyond the realm of possibility of her getting hooked again from being online.

[Domingo-ITA]

NAC- Thank you for your explanations. Ihave a clearer view now. To sum up, you’d want to get your marriage how it was before the three-years lag, but of course you can’t do much else than hope your wife comply, which sometimes she seems to do and sometimes not. Probably you’ll eventually need a full disclosure on her part, and apologies and explanations in order to be reasonable sure all this will not happen again - I agree with Long Lurker 34. Who knows, maybe you’ll be able to pass all this even with no disclosure.
I wish you well.

[newaussiecuck]

NAC - Seeing how much that online situation affected her it's certainly not beyond the realm of possibility of her getting hooked again from being online.

Yes I 100% agree, it's certainly possible/likely and I'm definitely aware and on guard against that. Any hint of a recurrence and it will be very strongly dealt with. The days of letting things slide are over.

Having said that, there's some small reasons to have some hope. The laptop has been put away now for more than a month, I'm not sure exactly how long but it could be longer. I don't think I've mentioned it, but I've been able to locate both of them. It's been packed away in the bottom of a box.

I think I've shown I'm deadly serious and PISSED about what happened and I think she got a clear sense of just how close she came to the end of our marriage. I hope so anyway.

I believe she's gone to her church a couple of weeks in a row now, which I hope shows signs of remorse and repentance.

Having said all that, we'll see. I still have a lot of work to do on myself, and a lot yet to learn. Maybe it's just a stay of execution while I observe how long lasting the changes are. There's still a lot of behaviours and attitudes that need to improve, but at the same time nobody is perfect and I'm certainly not.

Lastly, it's always been on my mind that all this happened at a unique point in time during Covid lockdows that dragged on relentlessly for 4 long months with extremely strict rules including curfews. There were a lot of people mentally broken by it where I live. Many marriages have been destroyed and many suicides unfortunately.

[newaussiecuck]

NAC- Thank you for your explanations. Ihave a clearer view now. To sum up, you’d want to get your marriage how it was before the three-years lag, but of course you can’t do much else than hope your wife comply, which sometimes she seems to do and sometimes not. Probably you’ll eventually need a full disclosure on her part, and apologies and explanations in order to be reasonable sure all this will not happen again - I agree with Long Lurker 34. Who knows, maybe you’ll be able to pass all this even with no disclosure.
I wish you well.

"you’d want to get your marriage how it was before the three-years lag" - Actually having thought about it that's not quite correct. I can't go back to how our relationship was before all this happened. I think I need for us to be equal partners without any of the femdom aspects to our relationship that we've had before. I think I need more traditional roles. Whether we can fully get there remains to be seen but it's worth a try. I can't ever go back to being a doormat and easily controlled and manipulated. I'm learning skills to better guard against that, setting boundaries and learning to communicate more strongly. Whether wife can get on board with that remains to be seen.

If I don't grow and change then yes it's almost a certainty that things will turn to shit again. At the same time, if I don't grow and change and I do leave my wife for someone else then it's almost certain that things will turn to shit with that other person too. Apparently having been in a relationship with a narcissist for so long my odds of ending up in the same situation with someone else are very high. I need to heal and grow to stop myself from being a target to wife or someone else.

Ending a marriage is a HUGE decision for me and I have SO many different factors to weigh up. There are pros and cons to both sides and it's not easy. No matter which direction I go, working on myself and growing will help in either situation so it seems prudent to continue that while I monitor how our relationship is going. I don't think anything needs to be rushed.

[joel68]

So have you accepted that there is no chance of any kind of relationship with N? What about her co-worker setting you up to talk to her with the cake thing? Do you think you read too much into that?

And about L. I know you said she has not brought her dog to the park since you gave her your number. But do you think that when you did that you scared her off? Is there anyone else that goes there that may know her that you could talk to or perhaps get her number. But then again, if she wanted to contact you she likely would have by now. But there's also the possibility that she put your number in her phone incorrectly. But if she did, then maybe she would show up at the park. So many things are possible.

[Long Lurker 34]

NAC - Seeing how much that online situation affected her it's certainly not beyond the realm of possibility of her getting hooked again from being online.

Yes I 100% agree, it's certainly possible/likely and I'm definitely aware and on guard against that. Any hint of a recurrence and it will be very strongly dealt with. The days of letting things slide are over.

Having said that, there's some small reasons to have some hope. The laptop has been put away now for more than a month, I'm not sure exactly how long but it could be longer. I don't think I've mentioned it, but I've been able to locate both of them. It's been packed away in the bottom of a box.

I think I've shown I'm deadly serious and PISSED about what happened and I think she got a clear sense of just how close she came to the end of our marriage. I hope so anyway.

I believe she's gone to her church a couple of weeks in a row now, which I hope shows signs of remorse and repentance.

Having said all that, we'll see. I still have a lot of work to do on myself, and a lot yet to learn. Maybe it's just a stay of execution while I observe how long lasting the changes are. There's still a lot of behaviours and attitudes that need to improve, but at the same time nobody is perfect and I'm certainly not.

Lastly, it's always been on my mind that all this happened at a unique point in time during Covid lockdows that dragged on relentlessly for 4 long months with extremely strict rules including curfews. There were a lot of people mentally broken by it where I live. Many marriages have been destroyed and many suicides unfortunately.

NAC - I can understand wanting to have your marriage 'work' for both of you. And the 'wife' has alot to account and make up for. I would suggest that if she was serious about wanting to remain together, if you tell her one of the conditions was to have regular ongoing visits with a mental health professional and mean it, you'll find out how serious her resolve is.

[newaussiecuck]

So have you accepted that there is no chance of any kind of relationship with N? What about her co-worker setting you up to talk to her with the cake thing? Do you think you read too much into that?

Well, I wouldn't say there's no chance but it's looking unlikely. I need to drop it now unless I get indications from her otherwise. For example I can no longer go and approach her at her desk, it's kinda been made clear (in a nice way for now) that it's unwelcome. Any further approaches to her desk at this point could escalate, and I don't want any harassment claims.

If I bump into her around the office by chance etc I'll say hello and chat etc if she's up to it, but I won't make anymore direct approaches.

In regards to the cake thing, yeah maybe I read too much into it. Or maybe the knowing look was a negative rather than positive look (I couldn't tell which, just it seemed they had spoken about me).

Or, it could be that the lady who gave the knowing look is interested herself. She did walk past my area on the way out from that workshop and I turned around to see if it was N, but when I turned around and looked she caught my eye and smiled and kinda waved on her way past. At the time I just assumed she was being friendly on account of N but who knows. This lady spends more time on my floor than N, I see her a bit more often during lunch breaks and coffee breaks etc. She's also closer to the lady that came out to invite us for cakes than N is.

Who knows really. I don't even know her first name and have never spoken to her separately. She's always in a group of 3 and I speak to the group in general. Maybe she's shy?

Edit: Last thought on N. I think she might also be under a bit of work pressure as sales are down etc. Could be that she doesn't want to give the impression that she's slacking off to talk to me on her work time. I can totally understand that. If she's interested she'll make reasons to bump into me during breaks and lunch etc, but I haven't that as yet.

And about L. I know you said she has not brought her dog to the park since you gave her your number. But do you think that when you did that you scared her off? Is there anyone else that goes there that may know her that you could talk to or perhaps get her number. But then again, if she wanted to contact you she likely would have by now. But there's also the possibility that she put your number in her phone incorrectly. But if she did, then maybe she would show up at the park. So many things are possible.

Yeah with L I think I also have to just let it go now. She knows where to find me if she wants to see me. For whatever reason she hasn't wanted to contact me or see me so I just have to let it be.

Maybe she's giving me time to sort out my marriage. Maybe got scared off when I shared too much. Maybe I read too much into the situation. Lots of questions and possibilities but at this point I need to just let her go unless and until she resurfaces.

[newaussiecuck]

NAC - Seeing how much that online situation affected her it's certainly not beyond the realm of possibility of her getting hooked again from being online.

Yes I 100% agree, it's certainly possible/likely and I'm definitely aware and on guard against that. Any hint of a recurrence and it will be very strongly dealt with. The days of letting things slide are over.

Having said that, there's some small reasons to have some hope. The laptop has been put away now for more than a month, I'm not sure exactly how long but it could be longer. I don't think I've mentioned it, but I've been able to locate both of them. It's been packed away in the bottom of a box.

I think I've shown I'm deadly serious and PISSED about what happened and I think she got a clear sense of just how close she came to the end of our marriage. I hope so anyway.

I believe she's gone to her church a couple of weeks in a row now, which I hope shows signs of remorse and repentance.

Having said all that, we'll see. I still have a lot of work to do on myself, and a lot yet to learn. Maybe it's just a stay of execution while I observe how long lasting the changes are. There's still a lot of behaviours and attitudes that need to improve, but at the same time nobody is perfect and I'm certainly not.

Lastly, it's always been on my mind that all this happened at a unique point in time during Covid lockdows that dragged on relentlessly for 4 long months with extremely strict rules including curfews. There were a lot of people mentally broken by it where I live. Many marriages have been destroyed and many suicides unfortunately.

NAC - I can understand wanting to have your marriage 'work' for both of you. And the 'wife' has alot to account and make up for. I would suggest that if she was serious about wanting to remain together, if you tell her one of the conditions was to have regular ongoing visits with a mental health professional and mean it, you'll find out how serious her resolve is.

Unfortunately I'm almost certain that it would be declined. The way she talks about therapists is very indicative that she would decline. She's very untrusting of the profession in general.

I'm still considering and weighing up.

[newaussiecuck]

"Who knows really. I don't even know her first name and have never spoken to her separately. She's always in a group of 3 and I speak to the group in general. Maybe she's shy?"

I just bumped into one of the 3. Firstly she had no business being on my floor that I could see. 2nd she kind of went long way around to I think use the bathroom on my floor?? The bathroom on their floor is much bigger and nicer. She'd already gone past the kitchen which is the only other reason I could think of for being there. As we passed each other from opposite directions she kind of had a knowing smile and said hello and then quickly put her head down before she passed me. Like a quick eye contact and look away.

Not sure what that was about, probably nothing. None of them came into the lunch room today unless they're coming later.

[whosbeensleeping]

Don't forget the advice from the old guy at the park.
If you had children it would be a thousand times worse than your worst nightmare.
I would be careful about "both sidesing" yourself.
When someone shows you they are incapable of love, don't let them then go on to convince you to settle.
Compassion is good, but compassion for yourself first is where things must start.
Sorry if I sound vague or cryptic. It's past my bedtime.

[newaussiecuck]

Don't forget the advice from the old guy at the park.
If you had children it would be a thousand times worse than your worst nightmare.
I would be careful about "both sidesing" yourself.
When someone shows you they are incapable of love, don't let them then go on to convince you to settle.
Compassion is good, but compassion for yourself first is where things must start.
Sorry if I sound vague or cryptic. It's past my bedtime.

Past bedtime or not I understand what you mean!

I just finished my next session with the psychologist and we spoke quite a lot about her behaviours over the weekend. Sore back and then going out to pull weeds and then further complaining of sore back etc. Then the splashed oil.

He reminded me that my primary responsibility is to protect myself because of her past behaviours and actions and attitudes have hurt and so far she keeps showing that she's still capable of hurting.

It's getting time to start asking her some questions.

He told me not to take on guilt by her actions if I haven't done anything to earn the guilt. Ie I never told her or encouraged her to go and work outside with a sore back. That's all on her.

When she's acting out like that I should remove myself from the situation and let her deal with it herself.

Interestingly the book I read had a bible quote giving the exact same advice!

"
It is better to live in a corner of a roof than in a house shared with a contentious woman. Proverbs 21:9
"

[newaussiecuck]

The psychologist called it "Attention seeking behaviour" and I think that's really spot on. It's manipulative but yes also attention seeking.

Tonight has been hard again as after having gotten a bit more attention these last couple of days and she's feeling more comfortable again the other side has come out, where she's having to speak over the top of everything that we're supposed to be watching. What she has to say is clearly more important than what we're watching even if she's saying the exact same thing as what we're watching. Thus there's 3 options for how I can respond:

1. Ignore her completely and just watch and listen to what I'm currently watching (It's not long before she cracks the shits from being ignored if I do that).

2. Turn and listen to her instead and miss out on what I was watching.

3. Pause what I'm watching to listen to her, then rewind it and go back to watching it until she opens her mouth again.

If there's nothing that I'm currently watching, and I'm just sitting there quietly doing nothibg then she'll be quiet with her head in her phone again. As soon as my attention is on something then she'll have to interrupt again to grab my attention. It's quite strange.

If I'm sitting quietly with my head in my phone reading something, then I'm quickly interrupted with anything that she can come up with to say, followed by "huh?" to prompt a response if I haven't responded.

So yeah, if my attention is on something she'll do whatever she can to put my attention on her. If I'm doing literally nothing and my attention is on nothing then that seems to be OK and she'll just bury herself in her phone.