Her Plan to Dip Toe in Hotwife Water

[afagehi7]

There's a difference between enjoying drinking and being addicted. If she is drinking in the morning, there's a problem... intoxicated 5 days a week, problem... Tying one on over the weekend is acceptable behavior for people who don't have kids. If it run in the family, certainly monitor it closely.

I don't get why these guys are bashing fish.

I agree with you on the points on alcoholism. Surely you notice that it is usually these same two trolling all of the good threads.

Yes, I've certainly noticed.

[afagehi7]

There's a difference between enjoying drinking and being addicted. If she is drinking in the morning, there's a problem... intoxicated 5 days a week, problem... Tying one on over the weekend is acceptable behavior for people who don't have kids. If it run in the family, certainly monitor it closely.

I don't get why these guys are bashing fish.

Are you saying that someone who see's a possible problem, and offer advice as bashing? You make it apparent your knowledge of alcoholism and recovery is limited.

A month in Caron and decade in AA, yes I still have much to learn.

[2inUPMichigan]

WOW. I've got all sorts of issues with your and your therapist's statements.
1. I agree with SW that you should not associated your self with the friend/enemy. So your telling us had there been 500 guests there and 250 of them were women you felt obligated to dance with everyone? No,no,no. You danced with that person either conscientiously or unconscientiously to have some effect on SW.
2. Your going to have a hard time with this statement, but it is true. Social drinkers do not have hangovers!!! They do not have to "sleep it off."
I am sure that there are a few people out there that have successfully quite drinking on there own. There is no one (alcoholic) that I'm aware of that has successfully cut back and stayed there. This includes my mother, myself and 2 of my children. We all tried and failed.
Just say'n.

1. I actually didn't dance with her, she got pushed onto me and I deliberately danced very sloppy and stepped on her toes so that I could beg away. The groom came off the dance floor after his dance with his bride, and took me to dance with his new wife, since she does love ballroom dance and the groom knows that it's my hobby. When more ballroom-style/couples-style dancers came to the dance floor, the groom pulled his wife to the next guy and she paired me up with the frenemy. The new wife does not know about the intrigue between this woman and SW.
You always had the option of politely excusing yourself and state you already promised the next dance to your wife.

2. Yes, it's a process that I see happening in layers. SW will try to "cut down" and if she is able (you know the odds) that's great. But if she is not, then we (she) must realize it's a bigger challenge after all, and start making the difficult decisions. I just can't be that guy, the bad guy; rather, I'm assisting and shepherding her to the realization.

I also agree the therapist was way out of line. I would have never gone back after she essentially told your wife to shut up and be grateful because she married "extremely well". How insulting for a professional therapist to place more value on one person than the other, certainly not her job to do so.

Giving your wife homework to watch porn so that she can find something to fantasize about, as if she is broken because she says she doesn't fantasize It is not a requirement to have fantasies!

None of us know the whole session or lead up to the session. Fish is a competent guy and I'm certain he hired a well qualified professional. The therapist knows what she is doing. We're just Monday morning quarterbacking when we only watched 5 minutes of the game.

I see..
So regardless of what led up to it....
What would be the reason that a therapist who is acting in a professional manner would give for telling anyone that they should be grateful that they married extremely well?

[Suchagoodgirl]

1. I actually didn't dance with her, she got pushed onto me and I deliberately danced very sloppy and stepped on her toes so that I could beg away. The groom came off the dance floor after his dance with his bride, and took me to dance with his new wife, since she does love ballroom dance and the groom knows that it's my hobby. When more ballroom-style/couples-style dancers came to the dance floor, the groom pulled his wife to the next guy and she paired me up with the frenemy. The new wife does not know about the intrigue between this woman and SW.
You always had the option of politely excusing yourself and state you already promised the next dance to your wife.

2. Yes, it's a process that I see happening in layers. SW will try to "cut down" and if she is able (you know the odds) that's great. But if she is not, then we (she) must realize it's a bigger challenge after all, and start making the difficult decisions. I just can't be that guy, the bad guy; rather, I'm assisting and shepherding her to the realization.

I also agree the therapist was way out of line. I would have never gone back after she essentially told your wife to shut up and be grateful because she married "extremely well". How insulting for a professional therapist to place more value on one person than the other, certainly not her job to do so.

Giving your wife homework to watch porn so that she can find something to fantasize about, as if she is broken because she says she doesn't fantasize It is not a requirement to have fantasies!

None of us know the whole session or lead up to the session. Fish is a competent guy and I'm certain he hired a well qualified professional. The therapist knows what she is doing. We're just Monday morning quarterbacking when we only watched 5 minutes of the game.

I see..
So regardless of what led up to it....
What would be the reason that a therapist who is acting in a professional manner would give for telling anyone that they should be grateful that they married extremely well?

I thought that comment was unprofessional as well. Out of line and really made me wonder who this supposed therapist was. Sounds more like a frat buddy than a professional there have been a couple of comments from this therapist that seem out of line. We saw a sex therapist for a few months and there was never any vibe like what is being described with this person.

[slenderfish]

I also agree the therapist was way out of line. I would have never gone back after she essentially told your wife to shut up and be grateful because she married "extremely well". How insulting for a professional therapist to place more value on one person than the other, certainly not her job to do so.

Giving your wife homework to watch porn so that she can find something to fantasize about, as if she is broken because she says she doesn't fantasize It is not a requirement to have fantasies!

Hi 2inUP.

We are with the therapist to assist with our communication in order to increase intimacy, as requested by SW. She also wanted to gain a greater understanding of my kink. The therapist was merely reminding her, after a tirade on my for being seen dancing with this friend (whom she dearly loves but they are temporarily cross with each other), that she does have a loving and committed husband, etc. SW took that message to heart and adjusted her negative energy during that session, and it was much more productive.

The therapist is a sex-positive woman, quite accomplished, and was speaking to SW's own observations about her sex drive fluctuating more these days (e.g. the off times). When the subject of fantasies was asked, SW said she "doesn't have them" and the therapist offered that fantasies can be on-ramps for sexual desire. SW asked how to best get started, and the therapist suggested a tour of porn (and recommended some of the female-produced and female-facing styles).

SW absolutely loves the therapist and I got such kudos from SW for finding this woman.

The therapist has no agenda here other than helping SW (and me) to achieve our mutual goals that were stated and agreed at the first therapy session.

[slenderfish]

None of us know the whole session or lead up to the session. Fish is a competent guy and I'm certain he hired a well qualified professional. The therapist knows what she is doing. We're just Monday morning quarterbacking when we only watched 5 minutes of the game.

I thought that comment was unprofessional as well. Out of line and really made me wonder who this supposed therapist was. Sounds more like a frat buddy than a professional there have been a couple of comments from this therapist that seem out of line. We saw a sex therapist for a few months and there was never any vibe like what is being described with this person.

See my reply to 2inUP's post. I think everyone is reacting more to my portrayal of the therapist session versus how it really went. I'll take responsibility for that. I'm writing excerpts because it's not realistic to do a full transcript. My writing is of course shaded by my recollection, my perspective, and ego.

[slenderfish]

There's a difference between enjoying drinking and being addicted. If she is drinking in the morning, there's a problem... intoxicated 5 days a week, problem... Tying one on over the weekend is acceptable behavior for people who don't have kids. If it run in the family, certainly monitor it closely.

I don't get why these guys are bashing fish.

Are you saying that someone who see's a possible problem, and offer advice as bashing? You make it apparent your knowledge of alcoholism and recovery is limited.

A month in Caron and decade in AA, yes I still have much to learn.

I agree with all that SW's use of alcohol is cause for consideration. SW has observed it herself, without prompting. She has started to have negative consequences; the frenemy in the dancing is unhappy because SW drank way too much last summer (July 2021) when they were out on girls' night, and ended up staying overnight at this friend's house. She realized that the friend had allowed her boyfriend to essentially move into her apartment and SW read her the riot act. SW was extremely harsh and raged and went off on the boyfriend (who was out of town) and it really hurt this woman's feelings. It compounded the problem when this girlfriend told her boyfriend about it, and then he was angry and ego-bruised, and has continued to feed the bad feelings between the girls. These two subsequently got engaged. Oh, and SW had originally introduced these two, to date, back in early 2020. So SW is now sad because of how it all went bad and now she (we) will probably not be invited to the wedding. This situation has really reverberated in our friends group, and fully spilled into our guy friends (guys' night) circles.

[slenderfish]

The therapist laughingly observed, during a session a couple of weeks ago, that we have a full social life. She's not kidding!

We traveled overnight to Switzerland and are now on the first day of a combined vacation/business trip. More vacation than the latter, but I've got some big projects I have to advance so will be working many of the late afternoons during the business day in the U.S.

SW is sleeping. We depart for southern Italy early tomorrow morning, joined by Ms. I and her boyfriend. I'm awake and working out the connections to my work laptop and personal laptop. Seems the personal laptop is all set.

[Long Lurker 34]

There's a difference between enjoying drinking and being addicted. If she is drinking in the morning, there's a problem... intoxicated 5 days a week, problem... Tying one on over the weekend is acceptable behavior for people who don't have kids. If it run in the family, certainly monitor it closely.

I don't get why these guys are bashing fish.

Are you saying that someone who see's a possible problem, and offer advice as bashing? You make it apparent your knowledge of alcoholism and recovery is limited.

A month in Caron and decade in AA, yes I still have much to learn.

I agree with all that SW's use of alcohol is cause for consideration. SW has observed it herself, without prompting. She has started to have negative consequences; the frenemy in the dancing is unhappy because SW drank way too much last summer (July 2021) when they were out on girls' night, and ended up staying overnight at this friend's house. She realized that the friend had allowed her boyfriend to essentially move into her apartment and SW read her the riot act. SW was extremely harsh and raged and went off on the boyfriend (who was out of town) and it really hurt this woman's feelings. It compounded the problem when this girlfriend told her boyfriend about it, and then he was angry and ego-bruised, and has continued to feed the bad feelings between the girls. These two subsequently got engaged. Oh, and SW had originally introduced these two, to date, back in early 2020. So SW is now sad because of how it all went bad and now she (we) will probably not be invited to the wedding. This situation has really reverberated in our friends group, and fully spilled into our guy friends (guys' night) circles.

SF - SW and alcohol. Just from reading your posts, it can almost seem that SW nearly always has a glass in hand. Seeing how much effort she puts into working out and looking good, have you ever pointed out that alcohol is wasted calories and she wouldn't have to workout quite as much if she drank less?

[Marco]

SW likes her wine and that is unrelated to any hotwife elements. It's just that sometimes when she is in the relaxed and uninhibited place, she will do sexy things (like cuddling or wrestling with her girlfriend or dancing on a pole in front of friends) that are apparently desires she doesn't otherwise permit herself.

What led to my question is watching the video of her in the pool. I found it sad.

The pool was a bit out of context. The birthday boy hosted a party in the desert and it was 90 degrees at midnight. His right-hand man made an arrangement with SW that if she went into the pool, everyone would follow, first behind her would be the birthday boy. So when that didn't happen, she tried to get the birthday boy to join her, but he was too shit-faced to even try. He apologized to her some days after, when we saw him again.

It doesn't make it any less sad. She looked totally wasted and everyone was either ignoring or laughing at her.

sorry which video are you guys talking about?

[Marco]

The therapist laughingly observed, during a session a couple of weeks ago, that we have a full social life. She's not kidding!

We traveled overnight to Switzerland and are now on the first day of a combined vacation/business trip. More vacation than the latter, but I've got some big projects I have to advance so will be working many of the late afternoons during the business day in the U.S.

SW is sleeping. We depart for southern Italy early tomorrow morning, joined by Ms. I and her boyfriend. I'm awake and working out the connections to my work laptop and personal laptop. Seems the personal laptop is all set.

Enjoy your stay in Italy. May I ask where in southern Italy will you be staying, just the area.
Regardless you should enjoy a nice weather

[slenderfish]

SF - SW and alcohol. Just from reading your posts, it can almost seem that SW nearly always has a glass in hand. Seeing how much effort she puts into working out and looking good, have you ever pointed out that alcohol is wasted calories and she wouldn't have to workout quite as much if she drank less?

Yes, I don't have to point it out to her. She points it out to herself, and acknowledges that her trainer (Mr. G) will be very displeased.

[afagehi7]

SF - SW and alcohol. Just from reading your posts, it can almost seem that SW nearly always has a glass in hand. Seeing how much effort she puts into working out and looking good, have you ever pointed out that alcohol is wasted calories and she wouldn't have to workout quite as much if she drank less?

Yes, I don't have to point it out to her. She points it out to herself, and acknowledges that her trainer (Mr. G) will be very displeased.

Wish he'd punish her with his BBC!

Enjoy your vacay. Y'all really have a serious social life. You hang with more people in a week than I do in a year work excluded

[slenderfish]

Enjoy your stay in Italy. May I ask where in southern Italy will you be staying, just the area.
Regardless you should enjoy a nice weather

Sicily

[rncinmd]

Enjoy your trip. Friends just returned from Sicily and loved it .

[Marco]

Sicily is about the best place to go for a relaxing vacation in Italy because it is a great combination of sun, sea, culture, food and low prices. I get down to Catania, near the Etna volcano, 2 to 3 times a year, get a car and drive around. Nice people and lots to enjoy if you are into history and overall culture or just hiking and beautiful beaches with clear seas. Great choice!

[slenderfish]

Sicily is about the best place to go for a relaxing vacation in Italy because it is a great combination of sun, sea, culture, food and low prices. I get down to Catania, near the Etna volcano, 2 to 3 times a year, get a car and drive around. Nice people and lots to enjoy if you are into history and overall culture or just hiking and beautiful beaches with clear seas. Great choice!

Yes, exactly. We did get a nice car and are at a beach hotel here in Catania for five nights/six days. Some nice pics already! Stay tuned.

[slenderfish]

SW got her beach game on, finally, and popped with her pink bikini, on Monday. Yesterday was stormy and the electricity was on and off, and the internet was basically nonexistent for most of the day. So we abandoned the resort and went for an adventure in the car. Ended up at the beautiful five-star hotel up in the old city, for afternoon cocktails and two bottles of local delicious white wine, cheese/charcuterie plate, etc. Made friends with some Aussies who are reportedly going to join us today at the beach, at our hotel. Our Swiss friends go home today and we will have two days alone.

On Monday morning, we were still adjusting from the time changes and ended up going the the little gym here, at 6:45 a.m. SW was in full workout/treadmill mode. I did some warm-up cardio and then worked on stretches and abs.

About a half hour into the workout, we were joined in the little gym by a guy whom I had to do a double take. Looked like could perhaps be the younger brother of Mr. G (SW's trainer). Super buff/cut and handsome black guy. SW looked at me and I smirked. We said a pleasant hello and went back to our individual programs. He spent all his time on the free weights, bench press, etc. SW at one point "worked in" on the bench to do abs.

We also saw him just a bit after, at breakfast. Was with a brunette, perhaps his wife or girlfriend. Evidently likes white women.

SW mentioned how he must really watch his diet and alcohol intake (e.g. no alcohol) to maintain such a perfect physique.

[Tryn]

Hopefully SW turns into a very naughty Pinky after your friends fly home! I think the combination of knowing a guy a little bit and being away from home is what SW really needs to allow her the confidence to let Pinky come out to play. Hopefully Pinky shows up with a naughty vengeance! Lol

[slenderfish]

Hopefully SW turns into a very naughty Pinky after your friends fly home! I think the combination of knowing a guy a little bit and being away from home is what SW really needs to allow her the confidence to let Pinky come out to play. Hopefully Pinky shows up with a naughty vengeance! Lol

This morning I deliberately made up an excuse for her to get to the gym and be there for a half an hour before I arrived, you know....

But he wasn't there when I arrived.

[slenderfish]

Quick tidbit. I am kind of playing hooky in that I didn't tell anyone I'm going to be away for three weeks (nobody in my professional world, except for one guy who has agreed to cover for me if and when necessary). As such, at the beginning of the business day in the U.S., I'm taking care to be "at my desk" in the hotel room and handling calls, emails, etc.

So today at about 3:00 p.m. Central European Time, I excused myself from SW and the beach, and set up shop in the hotel room, just as SW was ordering her second glass of wine at the beach bar.

But today is different because SW is alone. Our friends are back in Switzerland.

Not long after leaving her, she came like a whirlwind into the hotel room and changed into a very sexy beach bar outfit, wished me luck with my work, and asked me to wish her luck at the hotel beach bar.

[superb101]

It seems to me thats a huge and fantastic step! As beautiful and sexy as she is, picking up someone should not be a problem!!!

[eater]

that's an exciting development.

[rooster444]

I'm telling you SF, send your little hottie on a tropical vacation on her own and she will be walking like a rodeo rider when she returns home.

[slenderfish]

I'm woefully behind on our story and timeline. We've again moved locations, arrived yesterday in Croatia!